At UI, tuition is going up again:
Trustees at the University of Illinois are to consider a proposal that would boost tuition at its Champaign and Chicago campuses by 8 percent next school year.
The proposal to be taken up next week would push the costs for new undergraduates in Champaign above $20,000 for the first time. The plan would set tuition, fees, room and board at the flagship campus at $20,034. Students paid $18,550 last year.
(Hat tip: CapFax)
The U's have no choice as long as the state keeps cutting their budgets. Even in the last few years when the appropriation has gone up, most departmental budgets go down due to increased costs for utilities, health care, etc. Blago is a disaster.
"The U's have no choice as long as the state keeps cutting their budgets. Even in the last few years when the appropriation has gone up, most departmental budgets go down due to increased costs for utilities, health care, etc. Blago is a disaster."
As are his enablers in the State Senate, especially President Emil Jones.
And those in the Senate who support Jones, including our own local senator.
Will Jones and his supporters continue to support official "A" even as his name comes up in the Rezko trail more often?
I was figuring I'd have to stay in Illinois to finish up my degree for the in-state tuition. Makes me wonder how the rate increases are compared to other States. Might end up being a better option to establish residency elsewhere first.
--
Glock21 Op/Ed
Gee, maybe Coach Guenther could place a surcharge on those football tickets for the games in Detroit & St. Louis to make up the shortfall!
Got to pay for those MTD buses going in circles somehow!
Maybe someday, The NG or somebody will look into the vast amount of wasted money at the University. Offices and classrooms heated to 80 degrees with no thermostat control, for starters.
Maybe they will look at university priorities. Is an indoor golf facility really more important than the library?
Is it really the best use of tuition and tax payer money to pay someone $120, 000 to teach one course a semester with a handful of students?
Should parents pay $20,000 to have their children taught by TAs who have a pitifully low stipend?
And let us not forget the fees (i.e., additional tuition increases) tacked on to student bills.
Etc., etc., etc.
Good luck with it, Glock21.
Most states are all on the same page these days, basically making it next to impossible to establish residency for school purposes (note: Your tax residency status means precisely squat) if they can sense, at ALL, that you just might have possibly moved to the state for school purposes.
So odds are, you'll have to take some time off, if you expect in-state tuition anywhere else. Not only that, while it used to be that the "time off" was a year (meaning, move there, get a full time job for a year, then re-apply as a new student), more and more places (including IL, IIRC) have set it to at least two years, precisely because they're trying to avoid people coming in for a deal on school tuition. They want those out-of-state dollars because ALL of the states are slashing higher ed funding.
You can swear on your momma's grave or equivalent that you'll stay there after graduation, get a cushy job, and pay tons of taxes, but these days they pretty much ain't buying. The one exception is if you can convince your PARENTS to move to the state in question.
Le sigh. Seriously.
Anon 6:26 -- Right now there's a weird trend. Schools are all going for crazy amenities (fancy schmancy dorms, mainly, and swank workout gyms) because they are trying to compete for students as "upscale consumers" now that they can't get them solely by "it's cheap." The idea is, there are too many places, and they want the best students, so they attract students with the extras.
But then the extras make the price go up. Plus, with the states cutting the budget, the price is going up anyway. But then in order to justify the higher price... they think they need more amenities, which in turn raises the price. It's an insidious spiral.
Remember during the 2006 Senate campaign when Frerichs major campaign position was that he would be in the majority and would be a positive for the 52nd District? Now 18 months later we see that Frerichs is basically ineffective. He is just another enabler vote to the Democratic majority, i.e. Emil Jones and Blagojevich. In the mean time we read the Champaign County Nursing Home is going to lose another $500,000 in state funding, state water consveration districts are about to close because the state won't send them money, local schools are considering the sales tax as a revenue source because the state is failing education, the UI has to raise tuition by record amounts because the state won't provide any new money, Lincoln Hall sits rotting away with no capitol program, Vermilion County couldn't land the auto plant because this state is uncompetitive for business, headlines each day talk about the coming indictment of the Governor, medical providers have a hard time keeping up because the state can't pay it's bills on time, the list goes on and on.
Is Frerichs to blame for all of this, not solely of course, but he is FAILING the residents of the 52nd District by enabling the corruption of Emil Jones, the corruption of the Blagojevich administration, by not being a true leader, but merely a boughten follower.
But shame on the residents of the 52nd District for getting the government they voted for.
I said this before in another blog post, that because my Mom never made more than $1,600 a year and I had no father, my choices were limited as to what I could do with my life.
1. I could go into the Army and stay. At that time the draft was there and unless you were going to college you would spend at least a couple of years in the Army. 20 years later at 38, I could have a retirement pension and full medical benefits for you and your family. I was the principal appointee to West Point in 1964.
2. I could apply to General Motors, Hyster, Bonn Aluminum, Continental Can, Esco or some other manufacturing plants in Danville. You could stay there all your life and get a gold watch and retire. The wages were adequate and many people in Vermilion County did just that.
3. I could go to the University of Illinois and try to make something of my life through education. My Tuition and fees were $94 for the first summer I was there, and I believe they were something like $247 my last year. My Student loan was $4,500 and you could not get a student loan for your freshman year.
You could work and I did to make ends meet and with creative looking you could find a cheap place to live. I lived in a house in Urbana and my rent was $25, with utilities about $15, books were about $100 a semester and my meals were a part of my Student Supervisor job at Illini Tower in Champaign.
College was a means that even the poorest of kids could get out of poverty. It was available to all, if you wanted to give it a shot and you could make ends meet while you were paying off your loan. Even then $4,500 was pretty hard to pay off.
I just talked with a student who just graduated and that student is probably going to continue their education, probably in Law School. That student is presently in debt $85,000 for their student loans and will be in debt $250,000 after graduation. They will have a house payment and no house.
Presently, a college education is not reasonably available to a poor person, because they cannot afford that debt and debt service. Their parents probably voted for the present Gov. and State Rep. and Senator, because they always voted that way. None of the people for which they voted are doing a Damned thing to make the University of Illinois available to their kids and their vote has doomed them to remain in poverty.
This area does not have the large manufacturing plants around in the numbers that were there when I was a Senior in High School. And they did nothing to entice them back, they all located in Indiana.
The Army is available as it was in my time and is probably the best stepping stone for education. But that comes with a price, which could be very severe such as death.
Until even the poor wise up, the present elected Representatives and Governor are under no pressure to change anything. We are assured of 3 more years of Naomi and Rod.
To that end, I am, and shall always remain;
Rex Bradfield
"Is Frerichs to blame for all of this, not solely of course, but he is FAILING the residents of the 52nd District by enabling the corruption of Emil Jones, the corruption of the Blagojevich administration, by not being a true leader, but merely a boughten follower.
But shame on the residents of the 52nd District for getting the government they voted for."
For the record, I didn't write this.
Heck, Rex - I'm a fair bit younger than you are, I think, and even when *I* went my tuition (in-state at the University of California, due to that being the state my parents landed in returning to the US) was $1500 for the entire year. I didn't board, I had an apartment (there was no dorm requirement and most students were commuters). My rent in downtown San Diego was $270 a month (shared the place with two other people and took the smallest room). Transit was $50 a month for a pass.
I was lucky to have an actual good job, and so was able to get out of school with no loans. But thinking about doing it now, wow. Yeah. I have to say I do sympathize with people now, and think some of my own generation (and earlier) who like to basically laugh and say, "well, we paid our own way" should maybe give it another think or two. The situation is different now. (Not to mention the crazy competition and kids handing in personal portfolios and having AP classes and all that? I'm amazed I made it to college at all!)
At the UC, when I went, it was not allowed to charge ANY "tuition" (meaning, using student money to pay for faculty salaries). The money I paid was "fees." It's a slight bit of semantics, but that was changing when I left.
akibare,
And the really sad part is I wonder how many really great minds are not going to have that chance which we had. Makes me want to cry.
We should just take Rod and Naomi, et al and whip them. Our society can never recover the loss of those minds.
Incidentally, in my mind there is nothing "fair" about anyone being younger than I......LOL....
To that end, I am, and shall always remain;
Rex Bradfield
I despise Rod and Naomi, but to be fair, remember that this same dynamic is being repeated across the country at the same time that a greater percentage of aid is moving from grants to loans and educational loans are increasingly for profit with higher interest rates.
I think it's good for students to work their own way through college, but any costs beyond that for educational advancement should be fully substidized. After all, every economic study I've seen says that ALL higher education pursuit has a net positive effect on the economy.
It is the people who are to blame for letting it go on. The waste and corruption at the once great University of Illinois nearly staggers the imagination. Inefficiency is rewarded. Doing your job at the UIUC will prove harmful to your career. Now the University thinks it is a entrepreneurial business rather than a servant of the society.
Anyone who believes the oldsters' sympathy:
I have some bridges to sell. Cheap. If you're a baby boomer or older, you can defer your payments to the next generation -- that's the way people do things now.
I really hope someone finds a way to pierce the retirement funds of all the people who got rich on the backs of the next generation. There's no justice until most of the boomers are eating dog food in decrepit shacks as they wither in retirement.
Thank goodness I'm gen X then, I guess... *peers around nervously*
Now where did I leave my wrinkled flannel shirt?
"There's no justice until most of the boomers are eating dog food in decrepit shacks as they wither in retirement." spoken by a true SPOILED BRAT.
I was an orphan and had to walk uphill to school, each way, in the snow. I took care of my ten little brothers and sisters, and we barely had enough to eat. I cashed in bottles I collected and scraped up enough to go to school.
Now I am successful, and can tell everyone about how I struggled. That way, I can make excuses for those who fail while blaming "the system" or "certain politicians" for their falures.
Excuse me, I'm getting choked up just reading this.
Sorry Mudgeon,
I ain't buying it, you also voted for the same "certain individuals" and as I said, the generation of your children will also pay for your indiscretions.
They were voted in on the pretense they would take care of it, and they obviously have not.
To that end, I am, and shall always remain;
Rex Bradfield
On March 24th, 2008 at 11:02 PM, xian said: "I despise Rod and Naomi" Haven't you claimed in your postings on this site to be a Christian? Did you attend the Rev Wright shcool of theology? Sheesh.
Boggle.
No Rex, my children either already make more than I do, or soon will. They went to college, had jobs, struggled, and succeeded, all without the tear jerking life stories which is not to say they didn't have obstacles to overcome.They just did it, and don't seek sympathy, votes, or time to complain. Similar to how people have done it for generations.
Your story, touching, I mean truly touching, hand me a Kleenex, is no big deal. Not everyone was born with a silver spoon. But isolated nattering nabobs must think so.
Try some math, I mean, arithmetic. What did tuition mean as a percentage of income in 1950 or 1960? What has been the rate of inflation? Kids today have it tough. They have to pay a dollar or more for a candy bar. Why, in my day, a candy bar was a nickel! And kids were respectful, and tucked their shirts in, too.
Get your head out of the sand, and out of the 1950's.
*turns the other cheek*
"*turns the other cheek*"
Thank you.
It's hard to follow which idiot is more clueless here. But one thing is for certain: People are going to have to work harder now--for less pay--to subsidize the retirements of greedy Boomers. Of course, they see nothing wrong with that.
That's why--soon--someone needs to find a way to wipe out the benefits they intend to claim from the backs of others.
Yes, remember all these prof's and support staff need gas in those new VOLVO's too. What a pathetic waste of money. Take a look at the administration building. ... I don't think I've ever seen so many Assistant to the assistant to the assistant positions all pulling huge salary and benefit and mega pensions. No recession here, that's for sure.
Anonymous, I'm a boomer, and I held two jobs during the summers between college so that I wouldn't be saddled with debt when I got out. Are there problems with our current system? Sure, but I don't think it all has to do with evil, greedy baby boomers. Are current generations also sticking out their hands for all the government subsidies they can get their hands on? Absolutely. Where do you think all of the money for all of the social programs come from? And now the government is talking about subsidized health care--where do you think that money is going to come from? I haven't heard many people in the younger generations say that they think they have too many benefits and are turning some of those down. Face it, our nation has become a nation of whiners who won't do tough things, say no to spending, and suck it up. That's what it's going to take from all of us, and I don't think we as a society are capable of doing that.
CD, what more should they suck up? They're already subsidizing the retirements of people who were too lazy and stupid to "just do it." In turn, they get paid less. They are forced to pay into a Social Security system that has no money and likely will be insolvent.
The older crowd has a good shell game going right now.
I'm waiting for President B. Joseph White to make a statement like " Hey get over the tuition increase, Ya know like I told you to do about the Chief!!" What did that the Chief fiasco cost?? 10- 15 million? Hey what the hell it's only taxpayer money! Merge the sacred cow that is the Athletic Department into the rest of the University, they seem to have money to burn! Ron Zook could fart and raise 10 million bucks, And how about that new Baseball field!!! Home plate is 2 feet from where it's supposed to be, Where was the inspector on that job? In Florida.
Gergg: Who said home plate is not where it should be?
Channel 3 had the story last night.
I have to edit my comment about the new Illini Baseball field, The Pitchers mound is 2 feet from where it's supposed to be, I think it's 2 feet too Far back.
Kerr Mudgeon
Here is the math,
When I got out of school, my last semester was $247, my first job was from a Nationwide company (Hyster Co.) for $9,600/year, that is 2.6% of my total income.
Total, per the above. the last semester was $18,550 (That is for LAS students) Engineering is approximately $22,000 because of the lab and other fees. When I Judged Engineering Open House this month the Average Salary for a BS in Engineering was $57,300± that is 38.4%
That should be self explanitory. Beside, my situation was not unusual and I was not telling it to get sympathy. I was telling to to make sure those who post understood the disparaging difference in the cost of education.
If you want to double the percentages, be my guest, that will give you an idea of what a year is percentage wise.
Hope my math helps your understanding.
Incidentally, in my profession, ignoring history is a sure path to failure. Engineering is a profession of understanding past failures and making necessary changes to assure those mistakes are not repeated. You cannot see anything with your head in the sand, so I don't keep my head there.
I congratulate you on raising your children and their success. But this post is not about children such as yours who could be in their 40's or more, depending on your age. Candy bars were a nickel in 1958. It is about children who had the same economic background as I and are not going to be able to enjoy a college education because of the cost.
The post, ain't about me, sorry.
to that end, I am, and shall always remain;
Rex Bradfield
It is easy, and very knee jerk, to simply blame the current state office holders for the University's financial problems. But the exact same thing would be happening if we had Governor Topinka, Senate President Watson, and Senator Myers. We would still be living in a state that spends more than it takes in. Cuts would have to be made. The state's contribution to the U of I would still be either level or cut, and the U of I would still be raising tuition.
The real problem, I believe, is that the citizens of this state (and country) no longer embrace the philosophy of public education -- that all of us contributing money to allow all our children access to education is worthwhile AND worth supporting with our dollars.
Sad as it may be, I think the entire concept of public higher education is dead. The state only funds 1/3 of the U of I's operation, and that percentage is dropping. The future is that all universities are really going to be private universities, although some may maintain the tag "public", but in name only.
Jay-You maybe right many people talk about taking the U of I private, it would cost a lot of money to buy all those buildings but hey no problem.
I disagree that who ever was elected would be as short sighted as Blago and the GA to cut the Higher Ed. Budget. The Higher Education Budget is just part of a larger State Budget other Governors or GA members could allocate those State Funds differently then Blago and the members of the GA have.
"It is about children who had the same economic background as I and are not going to be able to enjoy a college education because of the cost."
"The world needs ditch diggers, too." Judge Smails, Caddyshack.
"But the exact same thing would be happening if we had Governor Topinka, Senate President Watson, and Senator Myers. We would still be living in a state that spends more than it takes in. Cuts would have to be made."
I disagree. Yes, cuts would have to be made. But this Governor and this Senate leadership have made it clear that UI is among their lowest priorities, and that would not have been the case with different leadership.
"The real problem, I believe, is that the citizens of this state (and country) no longer embrace the philosophy of public education -- that all of us contributing money to allow all our children access to education is worthwhile AND worth supporting with our dollars.
Sad as it may be, I think the entire concept of public higher education is dead. The state only funds 1/3 of the U of I's operation, and that percentage is dropping. The future is that all universities are really going to be private universities, although some may maintain the tag "public", but in name only."
Sadly, I agree. I would hope that Illinois Democrats would be fighting against such a shift. But, as we've seen, their priorities are elsewhere.
Where is Naomi and Frerichs on this??? The late Senator Stanley Weaver would be on every TV and radio station He could find talking about this! All Frerich's can talk about is Obama, Hey Mike I think your still a State Senator! How about acting like it? Frerichs and Jacobsen are just puppets, controlled by the Chicago machine, beholding to Blago and Jones. Also why are most of these classes at the U of I being taught by Teaching Assistants any way?? the news release from the U of I says the increase is needed to attract the best faculty, That should be Professors, but I guess they do not have time to teach with all the research and book and paper writing they do. I would bet most of them could not find their classrooms with a map! I have heard people talking comparing what other colleges do, Well folks We as taxpayers are not bank rolling other colleges! We are Illinois, That's the same lame comparison of "Well gas is $8.00 a gal. in France" and I'm not gassin up there either!!!
If we could just get Blago to visit Stan.
You know, just a short uneventful visit.
To that end, I am, and shall always remain;
Rex Bradfield
What percentage of UIUC expenditures go to adminstration and administrative costs as compared to 20-30 years ago?
Anonymous 07:36
Interesting question, I know when we paid that last rate of $247±, the general understanding of the Students was the increase was caused by the construction of the I-M Building. The tuition and fees did go up quite a bit that year and it was not consistent with other earlier increase, which were pretty small.
But for sure, now the U of I is subsidizing its operating costs on the backs of the students. Just look at the percentages which Kerr Mudgeon asked me to do above. The are staggering.
And finally,
Even the suggestion that the University of Illinois becomes a private school, speaks volumes of the complete ineptness of our elected officials. NOTHING could be a stronger indication of their failure.
When these nippleheaded Trustees were spending so much time worrying about the Chief, they were wasting time doing something that was unproductive in the operation of the University and certainly not conducing any kind of financial management or revenue streams.
To that end, I am, and shall always remain;
Rex Bradfield
I was on the University Senate in the late 70's. There were figures presented on the escalation of administrative costs that were incredible at that time. Even then the bureaucracy was stifling. Now inefficiency is truly rewarded at the UIUC. Many university employees feel that they have an entitlement to a job with benefits, etc. The notion of education and research, Learniing and Labour, is a tertiary issue if it ever even enters the dulled minds of the bureaucrats.
Rex, you are a pretty smart guy. Obviously here is a state-run institution, a land-grant university (UIUC) that is totally out of control relative to the needs of the populace it was supposed to serve. How do you propose that it could ever be brought to accountability in reducing costs? There is no Leadership. The faculty runs the University---dont ever forget that.
They are going to howl long and loud with their shrill voices if you do anything other than throw them more money. Money that the taxpayers in Illinois dont have. How can this mess ever be repaired?
"The world needs ditch diggers, too." Judge Smails, Caddyshack.
Spoken like a true "I've got mine" boomer.
Someone needs to start piercing retirement accounts. People shouldn't be living on money they didn't earn.
On March 27th, 2008 at 05:35 PM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
"The world needs ditch diggers, too." Judge Smails, Caddyshack.
Spoken like a true "I've got mine" boomer.
Ya the world also needs truck drivers, plumbers, electricians, laborers, carpenters and yes even garbage men! a lot of these are high paying jobs that need to be done. You give me an example of one of these craftsman that is not working and I will show you a guy that DOES not want to work. You want to meet people with college degrees, go to any McDonalds, or Wal-Mart they are crawling with "educated idiots"
Gergg:
You have some decent arguments, but I've done general labor before, and some of those people are just not smart. Yeah, they work pretty hard, but they don't do much thinking. And unless I was somehow at the bottom of the pay scale, there wasn't much in the way of wages.
General labor is much different than a Journeyman Plumber or Electrician, Carpenter, These Trades require 4-5 years training both on the job and classroom to complete the apprenticeships.
You're the one who said laborers, Gergg.
sought&found
I know, isn't it really sad? To use a little language from my small town, they are so bad they make me want to puke.
In all honesty, because of my personality and determination, I was approached by many of my friends from both this area and Vermilion County to take a shot at being the State Representative. Many worked for different parts of the Government, but many were associated with the U of I or had kids they wanted to go to the U of I and were not going to be able to find the money for their kids education.
I also could see what was happening, and I did want to be elected and try to make a difference, which I sincerely believe I could. I was not afraid to try and was absolutely certain that I could do more than Naomi. But as you recognize, Government is not honorable and certainly not based on the honesty and integrity we believe in as we progress with our lives. Elected officials or political appointments are more concerned with deceit and misrepresentation, usually through "buzz words" than they are in solving the problems. The general public truly has no idea of what is going on and throw away their opportunity to make a difference with their vote, by just voting for a donkey or an elephant, regardless of what the person is doing, or has done for them.
Also, those in control of the Government are very clever in the design of voting Districts, and make sure that the Ass (no pun intended) or Elephant is gonna be re-elected and that the general public is not represented according to their wishes. This area is a prime example of it and we are certainly paying the piper now.
But the running for office was a very good experience for me, because my business is seeing how things work and figuring out solutions based on the facts, not just political maneuvering. I got to meet some very impressive private enterprise individuals, that are and could really make a difference. But to a man, they all said the biggest albatross around their neck was the Government and its attempt to continually pay for its mistakes. They referred to it as the inequitable time balance.
But in the same breath, an unusually high number of the elected officials were absolutely clueless about cause and effect or how to solve problems. As I always said, their most important job was being most important. And piddling around, trying to figure out how many votes there action would affect, exacerbates the problem which made them even less effective.
A prime example of that was the Power Company debauchery. The Power Company had made all the arrangements to enter into negotiations to "bond" bond the rate increases and allow the consumer to swallow a certainly bitter pill, just a little bit at a time. The Government had leverage if they acted promptly and maybe even contributed some interest money. Instead, Naomi, fired a Bill into the mill, that proposed an extension of the Rate Freeze. That Bill was attractive to the voters in this District because her District is NOT a University worker district, but a low income pick and shovel district. I was clear that the Rate Freeze would fail miserably, because California had already tried that a few years earlier and it cost the Governor his office, mid term.
I said it would not work and that time was of the essence to act before the Legislation deadline terminated and the Power Company was free of any Government leverage. She and others did nothing but worry about the election and votes and we the voters paid for her procrastination with our money. But she had been re-elected by that time and was not in danger or her seat for at least a couple of years. So as you say,
"How do you propose that it could ever be brought to accountability in reducing costs? There is no Leadership."
Only until things get so bad that people are ready for at least a change of Representation, will the train continue down this track. Contribution money is enormously unbalanced in its effect in the Political choices and it shows.
Remember, the choice of who you believe is the most qualified individual to represent you in your government is the most important job interview you conduct. Normally you would repeatedly interview a person who is going to be responsible for Billions of dollars, but in the political process you cannot interview those individuals (no matter how qualified) unless they have money to present their views to you on the media.
The candidate with the most money will win 90% of the time, regardless of qualifications of determination.
New Mexico has found a way to better that system so the qualified candidates are able to present themselves to the public and it is working.
Hopefully before we check out, Illinois will have the same. Government, properly run, is a benefit, not an albatross.
To that end, I am, and shall always remain;
Rex Bradfield
This thread is getting long, but I am interested in hearing about New Mexico. 2 reasons. I am getting tired of Illinois winters for one, and for another I am interested in hearing
how things in Illinois might be improved (aside from encouraging some much needed local warming if not the more global warming that I wish I believed in) Maybe you can start a new thread.
On March 28th, 2008 at 08:06 AM, Anonymous (not verified) said:
You're the one who said laborers, Gergg.
Yes I did say Laborer, here is a link to the Illinois Dept. of Labor prevailing wage rate for Champaign County, All of the trades I mentioned are very well paying jobs.Yes the Laborer is the lowest paid but it's not a bad salary. http://www.state.il.us/agency/idol/rates/ODDMO/CHAMPAIG.htm
In these sorts of discussions and in news stories about union strikes, it strikes me as a bit odd how the driver behind the rising costs are typically not mentioned only that some entitlement is threatened or not big enough. In the case of the universities, those that often preach in an anti capitalist manner maneuver for highly capitalist salaries. Lecture a few hours a week, research something within your interest, con$ult when you like and who cares that student and the state must come up with $40,000 per year for lecture hall student to teach rations of 70 to 400. But hey, society is duped into valuing education beyond it's usefulness.
But that's not supported by reality Tom. Over the last decade, faculty salaries have not been increasing. In most cases, they have dropped in real dollar. What has been increasing are administrator positions and salaries.
Furthermore, what percentage of the faculty you mention do you think are represented by a recognized collective bargaining unit?
Finally, your last statement is economically false, unless you are critiquing the specific quality of the education which is a different issue. Effective education is ALWAYS economically positive for the society except is hypothetical extreme examples. It really doesn't matter what it is--pre-school to Business school, EVERYTHING creates net wealth for the society.
Now, if you are just saying that the current quality of these 400 seat lecture courses is lacking, I would never argue with you there.
Finally, your last statement is economically false, unless you are critiquing the specific quality of the education which is a different issue. Effective education is ALWAYS economically positive for the society except is hypothetical extreme examples. It really doesn't matter what it is--pre-school to Business school, EVERYTHING creates net wealth for the society.
Cosign.
I can't imagine a society succeeding in any way without an educated public.
sought&found
I will put some things together and post something on my blog.
To those who suggest entitlement programs are a significant part of the problem:
No question that entitlement and retirement are a large part of the budget obligations, but they are a large part because the legislators, (Yes, especially Naomi) have chosen not to meet the statutory obligations in a timely manner and chose to spend that money on other political pork programs.
Although, they would like for the general public to believe differently, the recent diversion of matching payments into the retirement fund was not "raiding" the funds, nothing could be farther from the truth. They did not raid the fund, they raided the fund before the payments became the fund. It would be like a private individual not paying their taxes, and spending that money on a car.
But when at the time which I graduated from college and others, probably 10-15 years after me were seeking employment, we were all presented with a choice between a Government Job and a Private Business job. Both had positives and negatives and both were interested in our abilities to provide them with a quality employee and on a larger scale, work force.
The primary difference was:
For white collar workers, large companies like General Motors, Ford, Boeing, John Deere, Hyster, etc. offered significantly larger salaries, but were not so strong on the benefit packages, like insurance and retirement income programs (for white collar workers). Conversely, Government jobs, like the Illinois Department of Transportation, offered opportunities to work on large public projects, but at a lower salary and significantly better benefit packages, including retirement income programs.
Graduates made career choices which were pretty simple overall, to take the money now or get it later. Some wanted the big income now for cars, homes, etc., while others wanted to make sure when they retired something would be there for them. Overall, in the end, the amount of money they received would probably be the same, it would just be distributed at different times. In fact, some government retirement programs were so significant, that employees were actually were given relief from Social Security obligations, in lieu of the retirement benefits being offered by State governments. The people made career opportunity choices based on their belief the Government was good to its word.
An incorrect belief.
But because legislators, saw the "pile of money" in the retirement funds, they made decisions to "steal" money from those who's only act was to work for the Government. Instead of letting the economics of investment principles allow the retirement funds to grow for their availability at the retirement time, the legislators broke the system by "borrowing" money from these funds on the false pretense of repayment in a future date.
Which they did not, and are not doing.
So it is not the employees who are the cause of these burdensome obligations because, for lower immediate income, they gave their skills to the efficient operation of the Government, in return for future payments in their later years. They could have given those same skills to a private company, and accepted the responsibility of retirement income themselves, but did not choose to do so.
The legislators broke the system (literally) and because they represent the "Will of the People", they have obligated the People to the financial burden we now recognize.
So to properly assign blame, Instead of the People incorrectly pointing a jaundiced finger at the older employes who's salary (and associated retirement) has increased because of longevity, in every election, the People should point their finger at Naomi and all others who have stolen from this fund.....
and say........
OUT!!!!!
To that end, I am, and shall always remain;
Rex Bradfield